Tuesday, February 20, 2007

support our troops?

who the hell do the rethugs and cheney and company think they are kidding? for 5 years now, many of us have been raked over the coals over not supporting the troops because we don't support the iraq war. we have been called traitors and worse because we are dishonoring our military men and women by protesting against the government in a time of war. well, i have beyond had it. for most of the time that we have been 'at war,' there have been many groups- veterans and veteran's groups at the forefront- who have been speaking out about the abuses and neglects of our active and veteran soldiers. we have heard about these folks not having sufficient equipment and armor; we have heard about them not getting paid- or being expected to pay back money and bonuses if they are wounded. now, it comes out that the national guard folks- who are fighting along side army folks and marines and the rest of the armed forces- don't get paid the same amount. when i read about the treatment our wounded and returning soldiers are getting around the country- but notably at what is supposed to be our nation's finest hospital- i almost had an apoplectic fit.

not only is this country putting our men and women in harm's way, because apparently, "money trumps- uh- peace sometimes," but we are not preparing them adequately and we are not providing them with what they need to survive- on the battlefield and when they come home. when these folks signed up, america made a promise to them- that they would be compensated and taken care of forever- for putting their lives on the line. these folks are coming home wounded and maimed and what does the 'commander-in-chief' do? thumbs his nose at them.

so- don't talk to me about supporting the troops. unless you are willing to go and enlist your conservative, republican ass in the armed service and go to the middle east- you can just keep you trap shut and stay out of the way. folks who truly care about the troops and this country are on the move working for peace.

addendum: re: national guard pay- active duty guardsmen and women are supposed to be paid active duty pay. however, many are not receiving their pay or benefits. the way i worded it above was confusing coupled with the link supplied so i am linking to another.


Spadoman said...

Bravo! Well stated. It is a shame and a sham what this administration has done and the line of crap they feed Americans.

Honor the Dead.

Heal the wounded.

End the war, NOW!

msliberty said...

Great post, Betmo!

The Future Was Yesterday said...

Give the fuckers hell, Girl!!!

Undeniable Liberal said...

It amazes me that the sheeple fall for this shit. Mindboggling, indeed.

Anonymous said...

You have said what a lot of people feel. Good work.

Eric said...

Quite the diatribe Billie. You're painting with a rather broad brush here condemning all conservative Republicans. Is this Reagan/Goldwater conservative allowed an opinion since I did serve in the Gulf?

betmo said...

you are always welcomed to have an opinion here- doesn't mean i will agree. until i start seeing some of the saner folks on the right standing against the current movement- made in your name under the umbrella of the republican party- then, yes, i paint with a broad brush. i have had contact with many veterans- from the korean war on through the recent folks in the gulf- and not all of them are on the bandwagon with the war that we so cavalierly started.

Eric said...

That's OK. I don't recall agreeing with you politically alot in school either. Unfortunately, Bush is certainly no Reagan, but now that we're stuck with this war, cavalierly started or not, just pulling out and heading home is not really a great option. Give me a solution, not a knee jerk reaction. Try looking here http://www.tommy2008.com/Home.aspx and here http://www.drafthagel08.com/home.html for differing opinion on the right. Bush is not representative of conservatism. With what he's done while in office his conservative credentials are just as suspect as his father's.

C-dell said...

I don't understand this. I think it is all about power. Only a absolutist would think it is unpatriotic to oppose the gov't in a time of war. We must stand up for what is right. I know that I will always voice my opinion. The american thing to do. we mus tnot lose sight of that.

Frederick said...

LOL, hell ya!

betmo said...

like it or not- bush and company are representing the right. the right voted for them and voted for them again. whether it is the evangelical right or whoever- you all are painted with the same brush- republicans. just like i am painted with the 'liberal' brush under the democrats. i am more right than many of my counterparts in this party- and i intend to jump ship and become an independent because i am tired of politics as usual with the yahoos that are in congress right now.

the one thing i agree with thompson about is the dividing of iraq- but that isn't an option being pursued because of not wanting the neighbors going in and taking the parts that they want. as far as me coming up with a better solution- it wasn't my side that got us into this mess- it's up to the idiots that started the mess to clean it up. personal responsibility and all that. as for pulling out immediately, we both know that that isn't going to happen precisely because we can't and it wouldn't be a good idea. but- if there isn't pressure applied somewhere- nothing is going to get done. hafta start somewhere- and ejecting these hiney wipes out of office and back to the fringe where they belong would be an excellent start.

there are some 'real' repubs out there- where they are and what they are doing is a mystery to me. why they went along with this admin for so long baffles me. why they allowed this to happen is also beyond me- you folks used to outnumber the crazies in your party- as the saner folks in the dem party did as well. we have gotten more strident with each right being taken away and with each lie that has been exposed and with each piece of corruption that has been laid bare. don't think i don't keep an eye on my own party. they are doing just about nothing and it is going to be time for them to reap the harvest of what they are sowing as well. guess i should save it for another post :)

Spadoman said...

eric... As a combat Veteran that served in Vietnam, I can tell you first hand that to pull out and ask for peace right now is NOT a knee jerk reaction.

We "cut and ran" in Vietnam in 1975, I watched them flee from the rooftops of Saigon, (Ho Chi Minh City). America got over it. Peace prevailed for a while. I am still proud that I served when I was called.

There was a time when there were only 3,145 dead soldiers from Vietnam. The war took a toll of over 58,000 and the result wasn't any different had we left Vietnam in 1968 or 1975. Why waste all these lives of our military? Or for that matter, the lives of any people in the world?

No one has defined "winning". When will it come? When no more bullets are fired? When all is "under control" of out military and we've wiped out countless people that our geovernment tells us are our enemy?

These tribal people from Iran and Iraq and most of the Middle east have been fighting each other for thousands of years. Our attacking another country to bring them peace and democracy was a mistake and it was based on lies. This has been proven. To waste another life of any human being is a tragedy.

I heard what you had to say. I don't agree with you and don't want to hear any rebuttal. There is nothing wrong with wanting the killing to stop. If you want war to exist, you are sick. Anyone that chooses killing and destruction over peace and love is wrong.

Even if you in your own herat believe that we were right in attacking Iraq, then you should want the war to be over and the lkilling to stop. If you still like the death and killing and want war to rage, then you are wrong.

I pray every day for people like you. I pray that they stop wanting to kill other people for any reason.

By the way, thank you for serving in the Navy. I know you signed an oath to protect the Constitution of the United States of America. That oath was for life you know, and it was against all enemies, foreign and domestic. I know you took the oath and if you were asked to, you would have given your life. That I respect and honor.

When you don't want the war to end and the killing of human life to stop, my respect stops there. No one should want any war to keep going. Any normal person should want the end to come as quickly as possible no matter how they feel about the reason for it. To want to be at war is always wrong.

Furthermore, what have you to say about bush saying that "Money trumps, uh, peace." I quoted it because he said it. Those are his words. That's one of those enemies to our constitution that I mention, one of the domestic ones. I will fight for peace, not money.

May peace prevail on the Sacred Earth Mother.

Eric said...

Spadoman, no rebuttal intended but please do not put words in my mouth and imply that I am in favor of war or killing. I have not said any such thing nor will I ever. War is never a good thing. At best it is a lesser of two evils. There is no doubt that this war, this reconstruction, and for the most part this presidency have been a clusterf*ck. Politics has once again trumped good policy and reason, but this is not Vietnam. The question now is how to get out of Iraq with the least carnage possible, now and in the future. If you could show me, or even just convince me, that just pulling out and leaving would do that, I would support it today. You may be surprised at the number of conservatives who may agree with you in principal if not in the details. These labels of conservative, liberal, Republican, Democrat make it so easy to vilify those that disagree with us. There was a time when Tip O'Neill and Ronald Reagan could disagree passionately while still understanding that each was sincere, and even, apparently, liking each other personally. I'm afraid I see precious little of this kind of behavior or understanding on either side of the aisle today.

Spadoman said...

eric, you wrote, "just pulling out and heading home is not really a great option. Give me a solution, not a knee jerk reaction."

I responded to this statement. I believe that it IS a great option. Peace is at least some sort of solutiion. I told you why in my comment. We did pull out of Vietnam and stopped the killing, but only after over 58,000 of our troops died.

I also mentioned the proven fact that these tribal people in the middle east have been fighting each other for thousands of years. Our invasion and unseating of Saddaam only opened the gate for the warring factions to fight again. Look at your history. Sadaam Hussein was puit in place to further our interests and stableize Iraq sio we could get a foothold against Iran.

The fighting will not ever stop, whether we are there or not. And why not try peace? There is no loss to stopping carnage, only lives and less suffering to gain.

We will always disagree on this I'm afraid. But to me, to not try peace as one of the options is a mistake. It should be the first option, the only option. There is nothing to lose in stopping the killing. By not stopping, the only sure thing is more death, destruction and suffering for all of mankind.

Ms. Betmo, I am sorry to carry on a discussion on your space. I'll not return on this post and I hope you allow me this intrusion.

May Peace prevail on the Sacred Earth Mother